Should religion fuck off?

[Pignoah]

Alright usually I'm the one defending religion, not because I'm religious, my family is so I guess that's why. And honestly, as far as I'm concerned, anyone who is atheist, or theist is wrong simply because, the idea that you think you know how we came to be is pretty arrogant and if not, you should be on your way to receive endless amounts of nobel prizes because you've figured out how life began.

So...

We should list out, and discuss the pros and cons of religion. And be sensible about it, for the most part, I believe, religion is mainly harmless, but I only really think that because in the UK, Christianity is basically half believed. However in America, some people genuinely believe the Bible word for word, yes all the beginning stuff, all the adam and eve and their two sons(yes two sons, explain that?).

I really don't get how it's still around, I mean it makes literally, no sense. Belief for beliefs sake is as stupid as it gets.

Alright, so a positive comment on religion. Religion, has in many cases, genuinely set people on the right path to becoming a contributing member of society. For example Snoop Pearson was imprisoned for killing a woman when she was 14 or something, and she 'found Jesus' and now she runs a youth centre for youths in Baltimore. To me, that's great, because not only has she reformed, but she now contributes in a way that is genuinely helping her community. Nothin negative about that.


Negative, misinterpretation. You read the Koran? It's beyond batshit insane. I don't have one on hand that I can quote from but I have been reading up on it recently, and there are several verses that demand non-believers get killed and if you genuinely believe in God, who you going to answer to? The government? Fuck that, you're going to answer to the supreme deity obviously, so no wonder there are religious extremists trying to convert nations through violence, cuz if they don't, they spend eternity in Hell? What would you do. Same applies for the Bible, and both the Koran and the Bible basically demand you treat women like second class citizens. Shit even St Paul demands it. I will come back with verse quotes to reinforce this but just take my word for it at the moment.

Anyway, what is your take on religion? Time to go or does it still serve a purpose in society? Also: is religion necessary for upholding the moral codes that most people here recognize as good/evil?

[Slim Trashman]

The two worst things to discuss with another: religion and politics.

The problem with people and these things is everything is opinion, and unfortunately more people than not are self centered and try to influence their beliefs/opinions on others. That and tell the opposition they are just flat out wrong.

That is where religion fucking sucks. But there's more.

Religion has played roles in major wars and events, maybe they are not completely to blame, but they were contributing factors. WWII - Jews were killed for being Jews. September 11th, 2001 - Radical Muslim terrorists attack the US, angry with our freedom of religion (OH WAIT, NEVER MIND. ACCORDING TO SOME THIS WAS CONSPIRACY CAUSE GEORGE BUSH JUST SUCKS). Etcetera. Now I say again, it's not JUST religion in these cases, but they certainly. undoubtedly contributed.

So theoretically no religion could have prevented such events.

However, religion is pretty much what shaped society into what it has become today, so perhaps without it, society would have failed long ago.

Personally, I have no problem with religion or people associated with it, except for people that completely base their entire life around what could just be fiction and try to suck others into it/insult those don't believe the same. Some aspects of religion are very interesting, especially as I've seen depicted in movies such as The Da Vinci Code and Angels & Demons (A&D was PHENOMENAL).

I am not at all a religious person, and I never wish to become religious. Although, I will always respect people's beliefs and opinions on it.

[Ritchie]

I'm not really religious but one thing I hate more than people who try and force their religion on you, are people that bash religion and think it's cool to be an atheist.

Like Slim, I don't have a problem with people associated with religion (as I believe in it myself, to some extend) but the extreme ones like you mentioned, the ones believing the bible word for word, or those extreme muslims can go fuck off.

[Kodo]

I will say this about religion as succinct as I can possibly say. Anything that is not within your present level of experience is simply a hallucination of the mind.

[lillb]

I was raised Catholic and used to believe everything they taught me in Sunday school.
It wasn't until probably high school that I started to doubt that everything was absolute fact.

After putting alot of thought into it I've come to the conclusion that the Bible isn't 100% factual (I mean how can it be if the stories were passed down for generations and translated a bunch of a times). I'm sure most of the events in the Bible happened and I've seen some History Channel specials where they look for evidence of some things and they found stuff backing up some of the Bible.

As for the whole Adam and Eve thing, every religion has its own creation story. Its how people explained how they came to be on the planet, something that to this day we still don't really know. Also the whole Moses and the flood story reflects with some other religions stories that deal with a great flood (i forget what ancient story it was but it had alot in common with some Christian stories) so I believe a great flood did happen but didn't cover the whole world as the Bible states and merely was the writer or teller of the story's known world that was flooded.

Anyways as for religion in general. It does serve some purpose to some people, like you mentioned the lady who reformed after going to jail and is now trying to do some good in this world. Cases like that are great it is only bad when people use their religion as an excuse to do some of the very things that their religion says they should not do. How can the Crusades really be justified when Christians are supposed to live by the 10 commandments, one of which states thou shall not kill?

I think it serves a purpose but extremists will always take it too far.

[Legham]

Religion would be cool if people didn't preach it to you. but becaause of that i fucking hate them all. Wish everyone could just leave everyone else to think what they want..

[Kodo]

This thread isn't going anywhere. It's like making a thread saying "Cancer sucks, anyone disagree?"

[Ænemy]

When it comes to politics, yes, religion should fuck off. Abortion and gay marraige should be legal.

[ska]

I believe that Atheism is life affirming in a way religion could never be, I only believe in the here and now and not an afterlife.

[Pignoah]

Yeah but Atheism presumes there isn't a God. You can't prove that. I believe there could be a God, as much as there could be multiple gods, as much as there could be no God.

[Slim Trashman]

The way I see it: No one knows, I don't care. It won't make any difference to me whether there is or is not a god (yes, lowercase).

[phlipp]

Honestly i think religion causes problems...to a certain extent.
I mean two different religions, two different beliefs, niether want to hear what the other has to say, therefore war.
Yes everyone has there right to believe what they want. But leave it at that, don't force it on others, dont be all like " My religion is the right, real religion.
I personally am a confused being; i dont believe in religion, BUT i cant help to wonder if a "god" could indeed exist.

But i shall stick to this quote until otherwise proven wrong
" Religion causes conflict, so i therefore don't believe in it"

[Piggus]

To me religion is nothing but a bunch of lovely stories passed down over the years. They originated in a time where science could not explain how things occur and how we came into existence. But they had to come up with something right?

But hey, if people want to believe in ancient stories that's fine with me. It's just too bad that it all ends up causing so much fighting.

Consider the amount of religious people in the western world. Now consider the amount of religious people in the developing world. Yep, things sure are going well in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

[Jay]

Religion was created by man to control people. Bibles aren't "the word of god" they are books written by people thousands of years ago, its kind of like a myth. As the years go by, more and more people add to it and change it while keeping the main features there.

Christianity for example, the entire religion is based on Egyptian religion, chances are that was also based on something before it. People only believe religion because they are scared of dying, scared that there will be nothing when they die.

The fact that religion was created by man, is more than enough proof that there is no god or higher power out there, there is no heaven and hell.

[Ænemy]

The way I see it: No one knows, I don't care. It won't make any difference to me whether there is or is not a god (yes, lowercase).


Short and sweet. And I agree.

[guilty.by.association]

Religion was created by man to control people. Bibles aren't "the word of god" they are books written by people thousands of years ago, its kind of like a myth. As the years go by, more and more people add to it and change it while keeping the main features there.

Christianity for example, the entire religion is based on Egyptian religion, chances are that was also based on something before it. People only believe religion because they are scared of dying, scared that there will be nothing when they die.

The fact that religion was created by man, is more than enough proof that there is no god or higher power out there, there is no heaven and hell.
This pretty much

[DiscoBombs]

I don't believe in gods or demons, or that the Earth was created 6000 years ago, I do not believe that there is a place of eternal punishment for acts committed in this nanoblip of an existence, nor a place floating in the clouds for being "good" (sounds pretty boring to me).

I do believe in the continuation of consciousness after the physical body has withered and died, I do believe that the mind has some wondrous place to go along with others after this event, and I do believe that its still necessary to be a good person.

I'm not in any way religious, but I definitely would refer to myself as spiritual. I do not however, let my own personal beliefs interrupt the daily flow of life.

Religion is not supposed to be about what is fact and what is not, it's about faith. I have no proof that what another person believes is wrong, and that what I believe is right. I hate most modern religions because they do not even have faith in what they claim to believe in, if they did they wouldn't feel the need to crush other religions as they could merely sit back in contentment believing they're right.

[Xan]

People should have religion. Gives them something to believe in.

Me? I'm a realist. I believe in what i can fell and touch, what i can see and experience. My stance makes me indifferent to any religion on this planet either it be Satanic, Protestant, Muslim.

Only, and only if people from said religion don't push it in my face or don't force others to it.

[guilty.by.association]

When i was 10 years old 2 christian women came to my door and told me i was going to hell because i wasn't with the church. I got so scared i read their bible and went to church for like a week. People like that make me fucking sick

[Xan]

Exactly. I can't stand that, not one bit.

Had a friend who wasn't religious at all, yet his mother forced him to go to church and hang with a certain group of people. Do certain things and basically told he was a puppet.

Soccer mom in a religious sense.

[Layorz]

Nothing worse than that, really. The whole forcing young, impressionable children to go to church, and hammering into their minds "God IS real" instead of "You can choose to believe in God" pisses me off. But, as a great TV character once said, if you could reason logically with religious people, there wouldn't be any religious people.

[j_harvill]

Jay seems to be a smart man if you look in the past there are thousands of prophets dieties and gods that all have many or if not the same characteristics as our "god". Romans Eygyptians Mayans Greeks and many others have had their own god like things. Religion was put in place to restrain society. If you honestly believe that there as a soul/man/being that lives in the sky watching and listening and judging everything we do and keeping records of it to determine our fate then you my friend are an idiot. I hope you write letters to Santy Claus. Continue to give your money to a taxless orginazation that is corrupt. I find it very funny that many believe our government is corrupt along with many other things in this day and age yet religion is pure and has never been corrupted for the over 2000 years its been around.

Everyone on this forum needs to watch a movie called "Zeitgeist"

Or visit www.thezeitgeistmovement.com and open your fucking eyes to the hell that we already live in.

[Lynk]

I'm not really religious but one thing I hate more than people who try and force their religion on you, are people that bash religion and think it's cool to be an atheist.

I feel exactly the same, those specific atheists you mentioned consider their believes to almost be a religion itself.

[Olin]

Parents only force their children to believe in their religious beliefs as a means of convincing themselves.

Obviously if you're deluded, you'll feel more comfortable knowing Timmy has no doubt in "god's existence.

Either way, I feel much better knowing that I'm open to anything, and that I'm not brainwashed by any religion.

[Jay]

For the record, I do not care what anyone believes in as long as it doesn't affect me or those I care about. Thats pretty much one of the main reasons I believe Islam is an evil religion, but I won't even bother going into that.

Anyway... if there was one type of religion or.. way of life I would follow, it would probably be Buddhism. Mainly because nobody tries to shove it down your throat, and its not about getting into heaven or being scared of hell. Its all about

[Jaytow]

I'm an athiest because I don't understand why I would be a christian just because that is the religion of my homeland where as if I were borne elsewhere I would be told to believe another God, I'm sorry but I am not going to waste my life worshipping something that (I BELIEVE) does not exist for eternal afterlife, IN MY OPPINION it is a waste of life.

[Piggus]

When i was 10 years old 2 christian women came to my door and told me i was going to hell because i wasn't with the church. I got so scared i read their bible and went to church for like a week. People like that make me fucking sick

What the hell. :/

We have people that come around here too, but they never say anything like that.

[chainsoar]

the idea that you think you know how we came to be is pretty arrogant and if not, you should be on your way to receive endless amounts of nobel prizes because you've figured out how life began.

It's also extremely arrogant to say, "you're wrong, your science is wrong, because I know that it is all the work of God".

Just sayin'.

[guilty.by.association]

What the hell. :/

We have people that come around here too, but they never say anything like that.
Word for word is not "You're going to hell because you don't go to church" it was the general point they were making.

I don't care if they haven't even said a word yet, coming to MY house to try to make me religious is fucking sick. It's MY property they can keep their religious crap to themselves. I choose to have no religion, they can leave me to myself and not bother me.

[Lynk]

Simply put, people by in large are morons. For someone to say that to you at a young age is fucking mad. No one has definitive proof of god's existence other than what has been written. I will never declare myself an atheist as I believe there is no tangible evidence that disproves god's existence. I always want to have some hope of an after life as the opposite is a bleak ending.

[Jay]

And honestly, as far as I'm concerned, anyone who is atheist, or theist is wrong simply because, the idea that you think you know how we came to be is pretty arrogant and if not, you should be on your way to receive endless amounts of nobel prizes because you've figured out how life began.

There are no hard facts... or any facts at all to prove that there is a god or religion itself is real, and I know "its all about faith, bla bla bla" heard it a hundred times.

However we know is that the bible/koran/etc and religious literature before those were written by MEN. And I'm gonna guess that they were written by smart men who wanted power, smart men who wanted to control people by scaring them and playing on their faith. Simple fact is its in our nature to want power, some people will go to greater lengths (i.e. create a religion based on multiple older religions) to get it.

Religion is a form of control, very similar to brainwashing. Parents brainwash their children by scaring them, and their children do the same to their children, and so on.

[Fry]

Religion is bullshit, there is no human like god who created us in his image, can hear everything we say, can see everythin we do and has a "plan" for us.

Like it has already been said religion was just a way for people with power to keep control of the mases by scaring them with tales of vengeful gods but also giving them hope of an eternal life with loved ones. God was widely accepted because at the time people were scared and superstituos and couldn't explain the wonders of the universe, so they wanted to believe in god. An all powerful being who is responsible for all the wonders and horrors we see around us. When something great happened it was god and when something bad happened it was all part of gods plan, Basically it gave people comfort and hope in a dark time when alot of people were scared and superstitious.

In the meantime rational people started noticing things had order in the universe and started thinking up theories to explain alot of these things and then putting these theories to the test with experiments. This is what we know now as 'science' and science has disproven alot of what the bibke has said and what religion has taught us. But religous folk just distort the supposed "word of god" to fit in and conform with these discoveries and to conform with new world view regarding morals so that they do not seem archaic and brutal.

But religion will likely always be around wether we like it or not, unless it is finally proven or disproven. Which i doubt will ever happen.

With all the said i must point out while i don't believe in religion i do believe there is some 'god' like particle or anomoly somwhere in space or 'hyperspace' which gave rise to our's and other universe's. But i believe this thing is not 'alive' it is mearly some kind of particle or anomoly which can give rise to the matter which become universes, which inturn create stars, planets and life. But i think this thing is so far beyond our understanding and reach that we will likely never truely understand what it is or how our multiverse was created.

[Kodo]

All religions are a means of getting at the truth. The problem is that one says they're right, and so the other must be wrong. Instead, since they are both trying to get at the same essence, if they included each other as part of that essence, they would be closer to the truth. Religion, science, drugs, sex, music, art, singing, dancing, talking, walking, crying, shouting, laughing, screaming, breathing are all just means of getting at the question "What am I and where did I come from?" What is God? What is the essence of creation? These questions all come from the same root of "What am I?"

Modern science is saying that the universe is all one energy. Einstein called it E=mc^2. Religion called it God. Everything in the existence consists of the same energy functioning in different ways.

[Zidane]

I will say this about religion as succinct as I can possibly say. Anything that is not within your present level of experience is simply a hallucination of the mind.

Quoted for truth. On an absolutely, brought down to Earth, logical and unpretentious way of saying it.

[Legham]

I agree with the "who cares" idea. Life is meant to be enjoyed, and no matter which religion brainwashes youm the point of life is to enjoy it so do whatever makes you happy. If researching shit like religion makes you happy then do it, but most people don't NEED to know the whole meaning of life to live.


Ifthis doesn't make sense its cause im drnk fuck oyu!

[Pignoah]

Parents only force their children to believe in their religious beliefs as a means of convincing themselves.

Obviously if you're deluded, you'll feel more comfortable knowing Timmy has no doubt in "god's existence.

Either way, I feel much better knowing that I'm open to anything, and that I'm not brainwashed by any religion.


I dunno eternal damnation is pretty good at convincing people.

As for the religion is for controlling people, yes, I agree to an extent.

I presume when it was brought about, there would have been far more simplistic ideas for Gods, maybe animals, or the Sun or something. And I presume, it was used for socializing. Religion originally brought nations together, discussing the ideas of God, it's universal, like music.

The problem is now, and especially in the USA, schools are teaching Genesis like it actually happened. I went to a Catholic school, but I never had to deal with this shit. They wouldn't take us to science and start discussing God. I guess we all applied doublethink on a fairly small scale but it was a mutual respect between science and religion. The teachers of religion at our school were more about the positive messages depicted in the Bible, and tradition, and anything else you had to find out yourself.

You can't call it science if you're teaching the word of God, it's religion, you can't put the intelligent design theory in textbooks as there is literally, zero evidence, and if the only plausible argument it has is 'You can't disprove it', then we should also learn about unicorns.

[Japisee]

Yeah but Atheism presumes there isn't a God. You can't prove that.

http://i27.tinypic.com/10zu4iv.png

[.:Mouldy Punk:.]

I very much have a "meh" view on religion. While I personally don't agree with a lot of religious beliefs, I don't really care if other people do.

I've met some people who have bounced back from some pretty nasty times citing God as their motivation. I'm not going to be the one who explains to them all the flaws of 'God' as an entity. Depending on what they believe I might think of them as ignorant., but if they take bliss from ignorance; good for them.

So no. I don't think religion should "fuck off". I accept that some people need it, other people don't. It's when people from one of those groups try to force their beliefs on the other group that pisses me off.

[flint.44]

I'm Atheist, I don't believe there is a god. Another persons beliefs don't bother me though, everyone can make their own choice. It kinda sucks though because I live in a mostly christian community, and everyone fucking bothers me as to why I don't go to church. I just want those people to leave me alone.